Ferge og Fergesamband

ropax said:
Norway is really very positive, modern and far in front of other countries with the tendering-system for the fjord-crossing-ferries and island-ferries.
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Actually, the ferry system in Norway is largely ruined by the tendering. Look to the modern ferries that has been rendered obsolete, somebody paid for them and yes, it was the taxpayers.
Combine that with the great revenues from taxpayers' money to foreign companies, and you know it has all been a great steal from the ordinary guy. Also, as a result, a vast hidden bureaucracy to manage the tenderings complete the larceny. On the other end of the scale, is the ridiculously mismanaged publicly run Caledonian MacBrayne in Scotland. The ideal solution is something in the middle, like the council-run companies we had before the hedge fund thieving started.
 
"the ferry system in Norway is largely ruined by the tendering"

Mhmmm, the question is - what is a best possible ferry-system for fjords and islands ?
I try it:
- so many departures as possible per day for maximum flexibility
- operation-times daily minimum from ca. 5:00/6:00 to ca. 24:00
- crew so small as possible for to hold the costs down and ticket-prices low
- modern comfortable and not with too slow speed operating ferries
- shortest turnaround-times, highest efficiency
- 100% electric or H2 propulsion

And if i compare this with other countries (ok, Calmac is the worldwide most worriest - i know no bigger ferry-scandal than all these things around Calmac, CMAL, Translort Scotland and Fergusson Marine) the norwegian system seems to be one of the best. But sure could many things be much better than today and not everything is perfect. Maybe some small changes in the tendering-system could help, f.ex. that the new winning company have to buy a modern young ferry from the loosing company for a price decided from neutral experts. And more options, f.ex. tendering with new ferries for 10 years - and if there was no bigger problems the ferry-company can continue operating further 10 years. I think that some contracts are too short - only for a few years is too less. And sure a minimum of bureaucracy and so less as possible of taxpayers money needed is the best.

But council-own ferry-companies can normally not operate with lower costs than private companies.
The state should only be responsable for police, judges, customs etc. - nearly all other things can be organisized with private companies - maybe in special cases "on behalf" of a council-own organsitation.
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Are there no norwegian ferry-routes which are/could operating with profit ? So that they don`t need state-subsidies ? F.ex. on the E6 or E39 ? Or Horten-Moss ? There are so many customers on the bigger domestic routes, if the crew of modernst ferries is very small (1, 2, 3 persons only with highest grade of automatisation) and with electric engines it must be possible normally to operate these bigger routes with profit ?
 
Hva skjer med Olav Duun? Ligget stille på Lund siden i 12 tiden. Lysingen går mellom Hofles - Geisnes.

Ser også at Vannes er på vei sørover.
 
Solskjel går for Fedjebjørn. Sistnevnte grunnstøtte i går kveld ved Fedje.

Fedjebjørn kommet seg til Leirvik i Sogn for rep i kveld. Redningsskøyta gikk sammen med henne fra Fedje.
 
ropax said:
"the ferry system in Norway is largely ruined by the tendering"

Mhmmm, the question is - what is a best possible ferry-system for fjords and islands ?
I try it:
- so many departures as possible per day for maximum flexibility
- operation-times daily minimum from ca. 5:00/6:00 to ca. 24:00
- crew so small as possible for to hold the costs down and ticket-prices low
- modern comfortable and not with too slow speed operating ferries
- shortest turnaround-times, highest efficiency
- 100% electric or H2 propulsion

And if i compare this with other countries (ok, Calmac is the worldwide most worriest - i know no bigger ferry-scandal than all these things around Calmac, CMAL, Translort Scotland and Fergusson Marine) the norwegian system seems to be one of the best. But sure could many things be much better than today and not everything is perfect. Maybe some small changes in the tendering-system could help, f.ex. that the new winning company have to buy a modern young ferry from the loosing company for a price decided from neutral experts. And more options, f.ex. tendering with new ferries for 10 years - and if there was no bigger problems the ferry-company can continue operating further 10 years. I think that some contracts are too short - only for a few years is too less. And sure a minimum of bureaucracy and so less as possible of taxpayers money needed is the best.

But council-own ferry-companies can normally not operate with lower costs than private companies.
The state should only be responsable for police, judges, customs etc. - nearly all other things can be organisized with private companies - maybe in special cases "on behalf" of a council-own organsitation.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Are there no norwegian ferry-routes which are/could operating with profit ? So that they don`t need state-subsidies ? F.ex. on the E6 or E39 ? Or Horten-Moss ? There are so many customers on the bigger domestic routes, if the crew of modernst ferries is very small (1, 2, 3 persons only with highest grade of automatisation) and with electric engines it must be possible normally to operate these bigger routes with profit ?
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It must be convenient to sit in Spain and voice all those oblivious views, even when having facts spelled out for you by people actually living in the country. Do you think it seems safe to travel with a ferry with a 2 person crew? Who will try in vain to save the passengers in the case of emergency?
I quit the ferries four years ago because the tendering system put the safety aboard the ferries in jeopardy by downsizing the crew numbers and because our salaries were cut to put money into the now private owners' pockets. But I'm supposed to sit here and have a Spaniard tell me tendering works better! When in fact it turned everything to shit! The golden years were in the 80's and 90's!
 
I (am not spanish but living there more than ca. 9 month every year) have tested personally ca. 93, 94 or 95% of all small ferries to islands (up to the North-Cape) or crossing Fjords, lakes, rivers etc. in Norway, Sweden, Aaland, Finland and Germany, furthermore Scotland, Canada etc. in the last circa 35 years personally with car. So i generally know about what i am talking.

Especially in Sweden, Aaland, Germany and Finland are many many ferries in 1-man operation since decades - and i have never had an unsafe feeling. It is the same as with buses, coaches, trains, smaller airplanes etc. - there is only 1 driver also - and a high grade of automatisation or manuell help as a strong cable from both sides.
F.ex. in trains and trans the driver has to press all 30 seconds a "dead-man-button" - if not - the train is automatically stopping. Similar system is also possible on ferries, f.ex. that an anchor is falling down then directly. Like an autopilot in airplanes the ferry-driver of a modern small ferry press only the start-button - than the complete trip is operating 100% automatically - including automooring, autocharging etc. . The driver has some video-screens and all under control - but the crossing goes automatically.

Because of the always rising up salaries of staff, crew, workers etc. automatisation for to reduce the number of working people onboard and in ports so much as possible is the future.
Is also in all other businesses similar - as f.ex. big (car-)factory halls with mostly robots working or supermarkets without cashier.

Similar as these former jobs (petrol-service, tram-cashier, metro-driver, 3rd man in cockpit) are today away
https://traminator.at/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/03-742x1030.jpg
a lot of jobs around and onboard of ferries will be in the future away, f.ex. also all "mooring-people".

Then the point of view is different:
Crewmembers has other wishes than ferry-customers and tax-payers.
So if you think that the 80ies and 90ies was better on/with norwegian ferries - full ok.
And sure not everything in the today norwegian-ferry-system is perfect - but i have another opinion and think that it is much better than in the past - and much better - and cheaper also - than it would be with state-owned ferry-companies.
 
ropax said:
I (am not spanish but living there more than ca. 9 month every year) have tested personally ca. 93, 94 or 95% of all small ferries to islands (up to the North-Cape) or crossing Fjords, lakes, rivers etc. in Norway, Sweden, Aaland, Finland and Germany, furthermore Scotland, Canada etc. in the last circa 35 years personally with car. So i generally know about what i am talking.

Especially in Sweden, Aaland, Germany and Finland are many many ferries in 1-man operation since decades - and i have never had an unsafe feeling. It is the same as with buses, coaches, trains, smaller airplanes etc. - there is only 1 driver also - and a high grade of automatisation or manuell help as a strong cable from both sides.
F.ex. in trains and trans the driver has to press all 30 seconds a "dead-man-button" - if not - the train is automatically stopping. Similar system is also possible on ferries, f.ex. that an anchor is falling down then directly. Like an autopilot in airplanes the ferry-driver of a modern small ferry press only the start-button - than the complete trip is operating 100% automatically - including automooring, autocharging etc. . The driver has some video-screens and all under control - but the crossing goes automatically.

Because of the always rising up salaries of staff, crew, workers etc. automatisation for to reduce the number of working people onboard and in ports so much as possible is the future.
Is also in all other businesses similar - as f.ex. big (car-)factory halls with mostly robots working or supermarkets without cashier.

Similar as these former jobs (petrol-service, tram-cashier, metro-driver, 3rd man in cockpit) are today away
https://traminator.at/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/03-742x1030.jpg
a lot of jobs around and onboard of ferries will be in the future away, f.ex. also all "mooring-people".

Then the point of view is different:
Crewmembers has other wishes than ferry-customers and tax-payers.
So if you think that the 80ies and 90ies was better on/with norwegian ferries - full ok.
And sure not everything in the today norwegian-ferry-system is perfect - but i have another opinion and think that it is much better than in the past - and much better - and cheaper also - than it would be with state-owned ferry-companies.
Click to expand...
Obviously, in your world, the customers and stakeholders are the only ones who really matter - it seems you have little regard for the working man or ship safety. As for the latter, it is clearly grounded in a lack of maritime knowledge. If you had any, you would surely never approve of crew downsizing and automation to achieve so.
Comparing German river ferries doing 3-minute crossings with Norwegian waters kinda proves it, to be honest.
That said, of course an operation needs to be finacially viable, be it a state-owned company or a private one.
I think Calmac will realize that the hard way.

As a sailor, I am constantly schooling myself on new tech and solutions, and I don't take your insight into ship technology seriously.

I am already aware of jobs gone into history due to automation - we are only just starting this journey as humans and I believe the consequences are yet to be seen. It could be a massive success, or just as well, slowly, a disaster for the working class.

Hats off to your interest in all things passenger vessels; I applaud such interest from the audience, but it would be wrong to mix it with actual comprehension of the maritime domain.
 
olajooh said:
"Vannes" har destinasjon Leirvik Sogn, er det klargjøring til sitt nye samband?
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​

Havyard Leirvik inngår viktig kontrakt med ny kunde​

Havyard Leirvik som er eid av børsnoterte Eqva ASA (OSE: EQVA), har signert kontrakt for ombygging av fergen M/F Vannes for fergerederiet Boreal Sjø. Fergen skal bygges om for å tilfredsstille krav fra Sjøfartsdirektoratet slik at den kan operere i et utvidet fartsområde.

For Havyard Leirvik og for Eqva er dette en viktig kontrakt av mange grunner. Verftet satser særskilt på oppdrag knyttet til ombygging og oppgradering av eksisterende skip, og oppdraget for Boreal Sjø er en bekreftelse på at denne satsingen gir resultater.

– Kontrakten med Boreal Sjø er viktig også fordi størstedelen av arbeidet skal produseres lokalt og utføres på verftet, og vi får anledning til å bli kjent med en ny kunde. Vi gleder oss til dette samarbeidet og har tro på at dette skal bli begynnelsen på et langt og godt samarbeid til felles nytte, sier Salgssjef Silje Smådal.

– Gode og krevende kunder er viktig for at vi skal utvikle oss videre, og vi ser fram til et slikt større prosjekt med en ny kunde. Vi er inne i en god trend med flere ordrer innenfor service og vedlikehold, og med to større prosjekt i ordreboka har vi sikret oss et godt grunnlag, sier Administrerende Direktør Tor Leif Mongstad. Det andre prosjektet gjelder motorbytte på ferjen M/F Veøy. Ombyggingen av M/F Vannes er et typisk eksempel på ombyggingsoppdrag som det er ventet at det vil være mange av i årene fremover. De har normalt en kontraktsverdi et sted mellom 10 og 20 millioner kroner og gjennomføres i løpet av en tre-fire måneders periode. Havyard Leirvik inngår i Eqva ASA-konsernets forretningsområde «Maritime services».
 
gøh said:
Bli spennende å se hvilken ferje Fjord1 stiller med her. Står 60PBE i sakspapirene til fylket. Det har jo ikke Fjord1 i Hordaland. Står og at det er reserveferge. Gulen er vel nærmest i størrelse.
www.nrk.no

To ferjer om sommaren

Til sommaren vil det gå to ferjer på ferjesambandet mellom Jondal og Tørvikbygd. Fleirtalskoalisjonen i fylkestinget (Ap, SV, Sp, MDG, KrF, V) løyver pengar til ei ekstra ferje i fire månadar. Ferjesambandet har auke i passasjertal kvart år. Om sommaren har det vore kaos grunna mange reisande...
www.nrk.no www.nrk.no
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Blir Lifjord, Fjord1 søker nå mannskap til sommeren.
 
Hordaland ligger på Lyngseidet med tekniske problemer. Lauvstad er på vei og har nok med det også gått sin siste tur over Toppsundet.
 
Ibestad har også fått Lyngseidet som destinasjon, men ser ut til å være på prøvetur i Sognefjorden fortsatt.
 
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